Aluminum Camper Forum

Hi Gary,

That sounds fine to me. 

A couple considerations before you commit to install this:

1. The shipping is going to be a pricey, as the the basic hitch is already factory welded to a 1/2" piece of plate when I buy it from etrailer and thus a bit over built before I even started.  This didn't bother me at all as I kind of liked it that way, overbuilt.  But it is heavy.

2. You really want to think about how you are going to drill the upper two holes through the alum. frame.  Don't underestimate the difficulty of doing this.  The bottom two holes are no problems and just take seconds with a sharp drill bit, standard drill + a bit of precision-care.  Alum. drills fast. 

The upper two holes are a problem.  It took me an hour each to drill those upper two holes, properly aligned and to proper size.  I used all kinds of cobbled together tools to do this, together with custom cut sacrificial drill bits I tossed in the garbage afterward; they were trashed.  With better close quarters equipment it might have gone more smoothly.  I used what I had.  I almost gave up doing this, and was going to cut the bumper off to drill these and was then going to TIG weld the alum. bumper back on afterward just to accomplish drilling those two silly upper holes.  In the end, I didn't have to do this, but it was tedious and slow. 

The design I came up with was the following for this 2' receiver:  I wanted those two upper through holes as high up as possible on that 2 x 7" alum. frame member and my steel plates to counteract the torque of the bike rack pulling down and thus handle bumps in the road, etc. with two mt. bikes attached.  It worked really well.  I doubt that frame member could tow anything behind, even a small trailer.  You'd want to go into the longitudinal frame members for that.  But for a bike rack, I like it.

The design problem one cannot see from the outside is ~4 1/2" up from the bottom of that frame member there is an alum. factory welded bar, 1/2-3/4" square or so that supports the rear edge of black tank.  It's welded to that 2 x 7" frame member from the inside.  You can't see that welded piece unless you drop the underbelly and look up.  This prevented me from positioning the upper through bolts for the receiver any higher up the plate than I did.  If I could, it would add even more rigidity and make the drilling of them much easier from the outside too.  However, this would have involved dropping the black tank and re-plumbing, and I wasn't going to go there.  This means that the upper two holes end up about in the middle of where the bumper is, as to not interfere with the bar that supports the black tank on the inside.  Thus, the drilling problem.  Those two holes cannot be drilled from the inside either, as again, the black tank is smack in the way.  However, once they are drilled and you get the proper length 7/16" grade 8 bolts at any good hardware store, the mounting of the bracket is straightforward with socket and wrench.  It's the drilling that took time.

I'm away from home traveling right now for the next couple weeks.  I be happy to weld it up for you when I get home, if you're still interested. 

Adam

Hitch Update:

After driving from Gardnerville, NV. to B.C Canada, I can report the bike hitch install works well.  No issue with trailer frame alum. welds, + no issue with my custom hitch welds or bolts, etc . 

For our particular mt. bike handlebar set up, I do turn the interior bike's bars slightly, so they won't bang the trailer on a massive unexpected bump in the road and dent the back of the trailer with that bike's handlebar ends.  If I had shorter bars, or a different bike, or an even stiffer bike rack, it wouldn't be an issue.  But there is just enough play in the rack itself...  It's quick and easy to adjust, readjust the handlebars for road trip and just gives me piece of mind it won't happen, even though the clearance on our set up is probably fine anyway.

For mojospeople:  Yes, we've already found having the bike rack removable and the ability to then reinstall it on your car once in an area, is critical to the ability to access trailheads for the biking we do.  We used this a lot at Hood River, OR. last week.  I haven't ridden most of the areas you mentioned, but we've been to Fruita once while crack climbing in Moab + Indian Creek, UT and decided to drive over for a long day to check it out and ride.  You'll love Fruita if you haven't been.  It's definitely barren though in its landscape.

Hi Gary,
Sorry for the slow response. We've been on the road the past couple weeks working our way up to Canada and no WiFi until now. I think my tanks are black 32 gal., gray 25 gal., and fresh 26 gal. judging by the literature, but I have not confirmed this myself yet on any of the 3 tanks. 

What I have found is with the black and gray partially full, maybe 1/2 way or so, maybe much less, as I don't trust the idiot lights in the bathroom for how full things might be, and the fresh maybe 1/3 full...  the trailer drives poorly down the road at highway speeds.  I don't like it at all.  I can really feel it sloshing around behind the rear axles throwing significant weight side to side every other second.  It's fine for a short distance, but I'm looking for a dump station for the black and gray ASAP.  Once I empty them, I'm happy again on the highway with things running very smoothly.  Maybe this is normal, but it's surprisingly pronounced in my set up.  This being my 1st TT, I'm probably just stating something everyone has known for decades...

Could I ask how you weighed your tongue weight? 

Using the CAT scales weighting with and then without the trailer, I came up with about 850 lbs. tongue weight for the same trailer, but I'm unsure of the accuracy of my numbers.  I've since moved some weight to the bunk beds in the back, but being unsure of my numbers, I'm not sure if I'm on the right track or not.  I know tongue weight is recommended as 10-15% of trailer weight.  If my numbers were accurate, I think I was up at 18%?

Adam

I have a 2018 LL 21 BHS Platinum w/off road package.  The tag on the side list the manufacture date as 11/2017.

I just tested my shower and it definitely drains into the gray tank as it should.  Lucky on the production line I guess.  I've pulled the underbelly recently for other reasons and the black tank is furthest back, then the gray, then the fresh.  Each are separated by a cross frame member of about 2 x 7" or so.

Here are a couple pictures taken a few minutes ago from the roof to show the vent stacks.  I hope this helps Gary M. in some way or others with this issue.

Adam

Thanks mojospeople,

My wife and I own too many bikes for our own good, but we do love it.  We are definitely concerned about theft as you guys are.  I've decided to make sure our insurance is up to date and go use them anyway...  Maybe being a 26 + 29" wheel bikes they will be less desirable to steal, but I doubt it.  A cordless angle grinder w/a cheap diamond blade will go through most any lock rapidly.  We'll see.

As for hitch mount bike racks, I've seen 2 I'd buy.  The Kuat, which we own and the One Up, which my buddy has.  But there are many choices out there, most of which are way too loose in the hitch mount for my taste.

Yes, my version of LL 21 BHS trailer [and I'm sure other current models of same] have 2 x 7" longitudinal frame members running the length of the trailer front to rear that are one single piece.  Then, at various junctures, 2 x 7" cross members are MIG welded in between.  Since it's fast production manufacturing, I'm assuming MIG and not TIG welded....  No beautiful stack of dimes look on those welds.

The other options I looked at to carry bikes were:

1. Copying the design of doubling up the 2 x 4" bumper and then buying a standard hitch mount as others here have done.  I almost went this way and bought a aux. spool gun for my MIG welder to weld Alum.or hiring out the job to someone else.

2. Doing a long piece of 2 x 2" steel bolted across the top of longitudinal frame members and further welding a hitch mount from there.  This could also be a solid solution that would provide good ground clearance for a bike rack, but a bit visually bulky.

3. Doing a long piece of 2 x 2" steel bolted underneath the bottom of the longitudinal frames members and welding from there.  A solid solution as well, less visually bulky, but with less ground clearance...

4. Pulling out the upper bunk bed in the back and storing the bikes inside with the added benefit of them being inside for security, weather etc.  This was my primary focus.... until I actually tried it.  The bikes just seemed huge inside. They were very difficult to maneuver around cabinetry without banging things up badly each time getting them in and out.  The aggressive tires chew up anything they hit very readily.  Even road bikes would not fit well.  That just didn't seem like a good long term solution to something we want access to all the time while camping.  So, back in went the upper bunk bed where I'm currently storing a couple kites and other random gear back there instead.  It's nice overflow.

Then I started noticing the 2 x 7" cross frame member I ended up using.

Here is an alternate design for a bike rack for LL trailers I came up with.  I started with this hitch mount    https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Hitch/Curt/13018.html   and custom welded a 3/8 x 6.75 x 12" plate to bring the hitch up and over the bumper as well as past the protruding black trim piece on the trailer.  This eliminated the under designed rear bumper from the equation all together.  No weight is on the bumper at all. 

I decided the 2 x 7" cross frame member [just forward of the bumper] was a more secure structural piece to tie in to.  I hope I'm right.  I would not pull a car with it, but for a couple bikes it seems solid.  I just took a chance and went for it.

I decided I'd sandwich the Alum. 2 x7" frame member with another piece of 1/4" steel behind it as well.  I then used (4) 7/16" Grade 8 through bolts w/locking washers to attach the 2" receiver to the frame member.  It seems rock solid now and hope it stays that way.  It has zero play in any direction.

If you can weld 3/8" plate to thicker 1/2" plate (stock receiver), the welding is straight forward.  I stick welded the 3 facing sides you see, plus across the back that is hidden from view.  The receiver I bought is overbuilt for this purpose, but it had the geometry I wanted, so I started with it anyway.  Further searching, might reveal other possibilities for a hitch to begin with.  One could also start with all the raw hitch pieces you weld yourself and go from there.  I almost did this. 

The crux difficulty for me was in drilling the two upper holes in the Alum. frame - directly behind the bumper.  It was extremely tight quarters to drill into for 2 through bolts, but I eventually made it work by custom cutting a couple different bits to length and cobbling together close quarter drilling tools in creative ways.  The lower 2 holes were quick as the bumper was just enough out of the way for a standard drill and bit.  I painted it black to match the powder coating that was already on the receiver and mounted it up. 

I have not tested this set up on the road yet.  I'll report back when I do.  My wife and I are headed to Hood River, OR. and then to Canada in a couple weeks for some mt. biking and kiteboarding.  It will be a good test of this new rack attachment.  I'm cautiously optimistic.  Just thought I'd share an alternate, yet currently untested design.   Adam

Thanks again. I'll look into a cigarette lighter type 12v outlet and find a clean source to tap into for it using thick enough wire and a fuse.  Thank you again for the suggestions.

I can't open the tailgate on my Durango either.  The electric jack interferes.  I'm running the standard Anderson WDH set up.  I should have bought the longer bar, darn...

So many excellent suggestions here.  Thank you for the expertise guys.  I guess I am not just overlooking something obvious.... Agree w/Merlin that in this day and age, what gives that this is not already done by the factory?  In 2018 it seems like a basic need for everyone boondocking at all.  DavidM's caution of leaving the 120v USB's in place is a very good one.  I'll plan to do that whatever route I take.

Then I'll need to grab a new 12v source and add my own USB's.  I'll need to poke around some more and see what's available and where.  Installing outlets away from the sink and over by the existing bedside outlets might be nice depending on wiring routing difficulty.  It seems the right area to charge things.

If I decide to go one step further and also add a small inverter for charging a laptop + camera DSLR batteries from the 12v system, [light amp draw but 120v], can I find an appropriate source to pull from in the back of the converter or is that not a good idea?  Or is this the crossover point where people are replacing the existing converter for a more capable inverter system altogether?

Rookie question:  I've got 2018 LL 21 BHS Platinum. 

I read in the manual there were supposed to be "aux 12v outlets located inside and outside in order to attach 12v devices and appliances," p. 27 of the manual....   I don't find any?  Spec. change, old literature or me overlooking something?

I'd just like to charge a Iphone or two when dry camping off my dual 6v golf batteries.  I can't seem to figure out how to do it.  Even the new stock 12v Furion radio won't charge anything via its USB port when turned on.  What gives? 

Oh no...   Is this why all the rewiring, inverter and solar talk on this site and everywhere else?  I wanted to avoid that as I only dry camp for 2-4 days in a row and keep power consumption to a minimum doing so.

After reading this I just went out to test mine.  I got lucky and it is installed correctly.  Good to know where the valve is anyway on a LL 21 BHS.

In testing my water system the past few days, I've also determined the fresh water tank gauge shows 1/3 full even when the tank is completely empty using the drains from both sides of it, the stock drain and the new one I installed.  This is consistent with what ADR has found. This is easily something I can live with.

Adam

Hi nhlakes,

Detailed info on your link on the Suburban water heater.  A good read and I've bookmarked it for the future too.  Thank you.  I think I understand it fully now.  Looks like the Suburban model I have has two toggle switches, which is a good thing for avoiding a burned out electric element.  Also, the suggestion of purging the LP Gas lines using the stove first was a good tip as well.

Adam